Just bought my first El Camino. '81 w/ 231 V6 (Buick Engine, HEI dist in front). Car ran, but a little rough, so I bought all new Cap, Rotor, Plugs and Vacuum lines (all sizes). AFter reassembling (made sure plugs are in the correct positions, did not remove distributor from engine so timing wasn't touched).. I have a no start situation..
Engine cranks great, but no start.

Pulled a plug wire, plugged in an old plug and grounded it to the block, and NO SPARK!

Chilton manual says to look for voltage to dist "BAT" terminal. Measured nothing....

Somehow, my distributor is not getting current anymore. All connectors are back in place (can't be mixed up since connectors are "keyed" to prevent this..).

On the engine control module, which pin "feeds" the distributor? (Manual doesn't say exactly).

Here are a few items I am suspicious of, but haven't checked yet.

1) The faint picture in the manual shows the two coil wires (red and white) in the HEI Coil in cap distributor, as "Crossing". I was careful to put the two blade terminals back in the cap as I found them... maybe they are reversed??


2) Didn't gap the plugs, (.080" is prescribed), but when I testing the old plug which was working, there was no spark...

3) For what it is worth, I unplugged the positive terminal from the battery before pulling the old distributor, but no the ground.. did I goof up and burn my ECU????


Engine error codes are supposed to be readable on this model year, but they all say, run engine before you look at them.. so I'm in a catch 22...

any suggestions??


(engine swap is not what I'm looking for...) :o

thanks,

Brian

If you put back everything you removed in the same place you took it from, then I'd say the Electronic module on the Distributor is bad.

Tuning up the car shouldn't have any effect on the ECU. I doubt that you damaged it. When the Electronic modules go bad sometimes they cause a engine to stammer or run a little rough then just die. It is possible that yours picked now to do it.

Recheck the firing order and recheck the connections to the dist. if it is all good then best guess is the Electronic module. They're about 30 or 40.00 at an auto supply generally. Good ones cost a little more (MDS, Accel etc...).

Thanks Pete,

I appreciate the guidance.. I'll check it our this afternoon.

If you did not see voltage at the wire from the ignition to the distributor, then you need to trace this back to the switch before buying a distributor module. Either the wire is broken, or the connector is defective ior the contact in the shell is pushed back an dnot making contact.

Good luck.

Pulled a plug wire, plugged in an old plug and grounded it to the block, and NO SPARK!

Chilton manual says to look for voltage to dist "BAT" terminal. Measured nothing....

Well, that'll do it. If you don't have 12V to the BAT terminal on the cap with the ignition switch in the ON position you won't get any spark. Did you possibly connect the 12V somewhere else? What color is the wire that is connected to the BAT terminal?

:mrgreen:

"Well, that'll do it. If you don't have 12V to the BAT terminal on the cap with the ignition switch in the ON position you won't get any spark. Did you possibly connect the 12V somewhere else? What color is the wire that is connected to the BAT terminal? "

Manual says look for Pink Wire from ignition to distributor in the schematics. After cleaning with soap and water, none of the three wires that lead to the distibutor look particularly "pink". Just the same, I disconnected the connector, and touched each wire with a voltmeter with reference to the block as ground, and get next to nothing (Ignition on).

Somebody help clarify if possible. there are two harnesses coming out of the firewall, one on drivers side, one on passenger side. The harness on the passenger side leads to the ECU. The one on the driver side leads as best as I can tell, to somewhere near the fusebox. The driver side bundle has a red, red, pink and purple wire (amongst others) which looks alot like the ignition diagram in the schematics... Problem is, I've traced that bundle which goes along the firewall in back of the engine to the passenger side. Then it goes forward divides off a bit, but mostly goes down the front of the block. Looks like it might terminate at oil sender, then something tucked under the block I haven't seen yet. But nowhere do I see a pink wire going to the distributor from that bundle (which looks like the ignition).

Should I be tracing the ECU side only??


Today, I replaced the coil (didn't need to), regapped the plugs, and made absolutely positively sure the plugs were in the correct order. (Stuck a twig into spark plug hole #1 while rotating engine to timing mark, verifying rotor was pointing to what little guide on distributor cap shows as number one... twig started rising as timing mark approached TDC).

Furthermore, I ran the engine codes.. it is not suposed to be valid until AFTER the engine runs (which is my problem), but for what it is worth, the code read "23", which is supposed to be a solenoid on the carb as either "open circuit" or "grounded". I uplugged the connector and code did not change, then carefully plugged it in firmly.. no change...



Tomorrow, I'm gonna replace the distributor cap and rotor (1 at a time) with the ones I pulled.. I didn't change anything else so it makes no sense. I can't believe that I coincidentily blew the ECU or some other electrical component just by chance during a tuneup... errrr, I'm pretty sure....

One thing bugging me..... I originally unplugged the POSITIVE terminal from the battery before the tuneup, not the NEGATIVE....

Is this a major "whoops"?? in terms of damaging the ECU?????


What's so unbelieveble about this engine is that it is every bit as complicated as a fuel injected engine (down to the last sensor!!!), with none of the precision, reliability and efficiency of fuel injection......
What was GM thinking????


thanks for the soapbox....

:lol:

The primitive ECU isn't going to keep you from having power to the coil. You have a broken wire or a burnt fusible link on one of the power wires. The fusible links are located in the wiring, just off the starter connection. Those coonetions down there can corrode due to thier low setting location, and exposure to exhaust heat. Whilt changing out the plugs and wires, it's possible you might have broke on of those power wires off while moving things around. Check all those wires coming off your starter, it be a good place to "start" 8)

I would agree that if the "BAT" terminal on the cap does not have 12V then everything else is a wash.

Pull off the wire, and you said you did, turn on the ignition, and you said you did, if no voltage is present then it will never start. It could be Pink or Red or Yellow but no matter it should be sufficiently larger than the other one or two on the cap.

So you can verify this by running a "Hot Wire" from the Battery to the "BAT" terminal on the dist. Try to start the truck. If it starts then you know what you have to do. If it does not then you have other problems.

It is completely possible that the Electronic module could short and cause that wire to go to ground. It should've popped a fuse if it did. Someone else mentioned that. So if it starts with the Battery hot lead then verify the fuse. If it doesn't then that module can still be the culprit but it will cause that hot wire to get really hot if it is shorted if not then you are in the same place you are now.

Just a thought or two.

Should I be tracing the ECU side only??
No, the 12V for the distributor comes from the drivers side harness.

...the code read "23", which is supposed to be a solenoid on the carb as either "open circuit" or "grounded".
That would probably be the Mixture Control Solenoid. The engine will start even if it is unplugged.

I can't believe that I coincidentily blew the ECU or some other electrical component just by chance during a tuneup... errrr, I'm pretty sure....
I don't think you did. Have you checked the ground wire going to the block?

One thing bugging me..... I originally unplugged the POSITIVE terminal from the battery before the tuneup, not the NEGATIVE.... Is this a major "whoops"?? in terms of damaging the ECU?????
No.

What's so unbelieveble about this engine is that it is every bit as complicated as a fuel injected engine (down to the last sensor!!!), with none of the precision, reliability and efficiency of fuel injection......What was GM thinking????
They wanted to meet the governments mileage and emission requirements.

:lol: Finally figured it out.... 1 wire was connected in the WRONG place... The pink wire from ignition I had stupidly connected to the temperature sensor spade connector on the intake manifold... I had no spark cause I'd never been providing juice to the distributor...
the crappy chilton manual I have has photos so poor, that I never say there was a second wire that connected to the distibutor...


thanks for the help everyone.... I now know every system on that engine much more than I ever wanted to....

:)

[Homer Voice]

DOH!

[/Homer Voice]

Glad you finally got it. 8-)

:P :? :lol: :lol: :lol: