Mild Cam Upgrade [Archive] - El Camino Central Forum : Chevrolet El Camino Forums

: Mild Cam Upgrade


Adamizme
03-22-2009, 07:03 AM
I have an 87 El Camino with a stock GM Goodwrench LM1 350. I have Holly Hooker headers, an edelbrock intake & 4 barrel carb & K&N air filter. I have also put a Tremec TKO-500 in the car as well as 3.42 gears. I also have a MSD Ignition system on the way. This motor has almost no top end to speak of and I'd like to change that by putting a mild cam in this motor.

I found some budget cam kits but I'm not even 100% that they will work with this motor. This is the one I'm looking at:
http://www.competitionproducts.com/prodinfo.asp?number=E1029M (http://www.competitionproducts.com/prodinfo.asp?number=E1029M)

Here are all of the kits on that site as well as more specs on the one listed above as it is the first one in the list:
http://competitionproducts.com/products.asp?dept=294&pagenumber=3&sort_on=&sort_by=

I'd like to gain as much top end as I can without doing any major modifications to the rest of the motor and without loosing any bottom end. I'd also like the car to still get decent gas mileage. Any advice and recommendations would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance!

Adamizme
03-22-2009, 09:12 AM
Here are the specs on the LM1:

Engine Name: 350 LM1
Horsepower: 249 HP @ 5,000 RPM
Torque: 304 Ft/Lbs @ 3,500 RPM
Compression Ratio: 8.50 to 1
Block: 4 – Bolt, 2 Piece Rear Seal, 4.000” Bore
Crankshaft: Cast Nodular 3.480” Stroke
Heads: Cast Iron, 76cc
Valves: 1.940” / 1.600”
Camshaft lift: 0.390” / 0.410” Hydraulic
Duration @ 0.050”: 195° / 202°
Intake: Not Included
Part # 10067353

toms84ss
03-22-2009, 10:25 AM
Well, one problem your going to have is your compression ratio. I would look into changing to a set of Voetec heads. You've done all the right things to make the car breath but that little cam and low compression ratio are killing you on the top end. Any of those cams will help, but more compression will help more. Since your running a manual transmission, you can run a bigger cam and not worry about a stall convertor. What kind of RPM are you looking to turn with it? I would imagine you have a stock cast bottom end in that engine. I think I would limit the RPM to a 5500 RPM redline. The E922M cam looks to be a good choice for your application. You can always call the manufacturer and tell them what you have and get a recomendation from them. Good luck.

Adamizme
03-22-2009, 02:14 PM
I'd like to eventually put a LS motor with fuel injection in my 'camino. I just want to wake up this motor a little with a cam. For grins, I'd like to rough up the idle a little while I'm at it.

I currently only bring it up to 5000rpm so 5500 seems like it would be plenty. I don’t know much about different cam profiles. Why would you pick the E922M over the E1029M?

I’ll be driving it almost daily so I’d like to keep most of the drivability and efficiency. Everything I’ve read about this motor says to immediately swap the heads and cam. Heads are a bit expensive so I was trying to give it a little something with the cam. How would swapping the heads to something with higher compression affect the efficiency of the motor? Would I have any problems by swapping the cam and not the heads? What kind of power gains would I be looking at either way?

Sorry for all the questions. I've been reading a lot, but I guess I could also use a little educating.
Thanks again!

badmoon47
03-22-2009, 03:08 PM
I recently installed a CompCams XE250H cam into my 1979 ElCo. It really woke up my little 305 and would do the same for your 350. The specs are :

Lift 4.32/4.44
Duration 250/260
Lobe Seperation Angle 110
RPM Range 600-4600 RPMS

Pulls 15" vacuum at idle. Great low end torque. I don't race it, so I really don't know how well it pulls in the upper RPM range. Hope this gives you some ideas.

toms84ss
03-22-2009, 03:57 PM
Hard to say what you might pick up in HP with different swaps. Lets say you swapped a set of Vortec heads on your engine. I'd guestimate between the increase in compression and the more efecient head design you'd pick up 20 HP. Keep in mind you have to have a Vortec specific manifold. With a cam and head swap I would say 40HP increase depending on what cam you went with. Cam alone maybe 20 HP increase, again depending on profile. The reason I picked the E922M over the E1029M camshaft is it would extend your RPM range so you could take advantage of that 5 speed and the gear swap. The E1029M cam is not much bigger then the cam your running now. So you would have a small gain ih HP for a lot of work. Keep in mind these are all guesses and just my opinion.

Adamizme
03-22-2009, 04:13 PM
I agree with your logic about the different cams. The E922M doesn't say anything about the idle and I'd like a bit of a rough idle. Is it assumed that it has a rough idle if it is supposed to be run over 1500rpm? Roughly how would this affect my mpg with just the cam?

toms84ss
03-22-2009, 04:44 PM
The RPM range shown on the charts is the power range the camshaft builds the most power. That cam probably has a very slight lope at idle. When you start looking at aftermarket parts you'll see a recommended RPM range for some products like intake manifolds and camshafts. You need to match your parts for the RPM range you intend to make your power in. With your stock bottom end I would stay below 5500 RPM. If you pick a big choppy cam and have a low compression motor and no gearing to help it accelerate its going to be a dog. Same with bolting a big fat 4 bbl. carb on. It wont help if you dont have all the supporting pieces in place. You aren't going to get the racey sounding cam and good gas mileage. Concentrate on getting parts that will give you a nice power increase and still be drivable. You'll be happier in the long run.

Adamizme
03-22-2009, 05:01 PM
I had a cam in my original 305 before I lost oil pressure and swapped the motor. I have no clue what kind of cam it was, but it had a nice little lobe sound. I think I'm going to go for the E922M. I'll call Elgin tomorrow morning to get their opinion before I order. Thanks for the help!

I was thinking... Correct me if I'm wrong, but wouldn't my setup, with low compression and all, be pretty good for forced induction? I wouldn't mind putting a supercharger on the LM-1 if I decide to keep it for a while. It only has like 18k miles. ...Then again, the money I'd spend on a supercharger & install could pretty much buy a LS1.

toms84ss
03-22-2009, 05:34 PM
Yes, low compression works well with forced induction. But cast parts wont last long with high boost #'s. You would also be way ahead of the game with better flowing heads to take advantage of the extra airflow. There's always a catch isn't there. By the way. You may want to research this but I dont think that TKO will bolt up to that LSX engine with out a special conversion package.

Adamizme
03-22-2009, 06:05 PM
I was thinking like 6lbs out of a small self contained belt driven turbo. That would really kill my mileage, though. Maybe if I keep my lil POS civic as a daily driver I will do something crazy like that. Like you said, there's always something. I'll put in the research when I have the money to do all of this. Thanks again for the help!

I'm kinda looking at heads now. I found a couple "refurbished" heads for around $400/pair. Will any of these fit my LM1 if they say they're for a 350?

ex. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/CHEVY-CHEVROLET-VORTEC-5-7L-CYLINDER-HEAD_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trkparmsZ72Q3a1171Q7c66Q3a 2Q7c65Q3a12Q7c39Q3a1Q7c240Q3a1318Q7c301Q3a0Q7c293Q 3a1Q7c294Q3a50QQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZite m370091819509QQitemZ370091819509QQptZMotorsQ5fCarQ 5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories

toms84ss
03-22-2009, 06:29 PM
Turbos are exhaust driven, blowers are belt driven. Those heads would bolt on, but again you need the Vortec specific intake manifold. Also, they require a set of Vortec heads for exchange. Not sure how much they would charge for a core if you don't have any to exchange. You dont have to use Vortec heads. I used them as an example as most people think they are the best "bang for the buck" cast iron head GM has for the SBC. You could use other heads with a 64 CC combustion chamber size and raise the compression. You need to decide what your really going to do with the car and build accordingly. You'll get lots of good advice here on this board if you just ask.

Adamizme
03-23-2009, 09:48 AM
I think I've decided to hold off on the cam until I can afford a set of heads. Can anyone recommend a set of heads that will work with my block and intake that wont break the bank? I'd like to stay under $600 for the pair. Aluminum heads would be nice, but from what I've seen, they are closer to 2x the price.

Adamizme
03-23-2009, 10:17 AM
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/NEW-SBC-CHEVY-Vortec-Dual-Plane-Aluminum-Intake-305-350_W0QQitemZ330315131138QQcmdZViewItemQQptZMotors _Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories?hash=item330315131138&_trksid=p4506.c0.m245&_trkparms=72%3A1171%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A131 8 (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/NEW-SBC-CHEVY-Vortec-Dual-Plane-Aluminum-Intake-305-350_W0QQitemZ330315131138QQcmdZViewItemQQptZMotors _Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories?hash=item330315131138&_trksid=p4506.c0.m245&_trkparms=72%3A1171%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A131 8)
This intake seems like it's about what I want since it's rated for idle-5500rpm. Would I have any problems using this intake with the vortec heads listed above?

Adamizme
03-23-2009, 10:17 AM
oops! Duplicate post.

Adamizme
03-23-2009, 10:20 AM
Or how about one of these two?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Edelbrock-2116-Intake-Manifold-Performer-Vortec-Chevy_W0QQitemZ220366330987QQcmdZViewItemQQptZMoto rs_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories?hash=item2203663309 87&_trksid=p4506.c0.m245&_trkparms=72%3A1171%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A131 8 (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Edelbrock-2116-Intake-Manifold-Performer-Vortec-Chevy_W0QQitemZ220366330987QQcmdZViewItemQQptZMoto rs_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories?hash=item2203663309 87&_trksid=p4506.c0.m245&_trkparms=72%3A1171%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A131 8)

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/SBC-Chevy-Dual-Plane-Alum-Intake-Manifold-Vortec-Gen-1_W0QQitemZ400037133100QQcmdZViewItemQQptZMotors_C ar_Truck_Parts_Accessories?hash=item400037133100&_trksid=p4506.c0.m245&_trkparms=72%3A1171%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A131 8

Adamizme
03-23-2009, 10:20 AM
Wow... Another duplicate post. This site runs a little slow during the day. I'm not hitting "save" twice. Ohwell... Any help with my heads/intake questions is greatly appreciated!