[kraziac]

Hi all,
This is my first post, and I've been browsing around for a bit now. I have a few questions regarding some performance upgrades that I'm looking into putting in my 71 el camino. I've got a crate 350 goodwrench small block with and edelbrock air gap manifold and a holley 4barrel carb. While the motor is great, and have no problems with it, but I crave a bit more muscle.
One idea was to get the Edelbrock 2099 power package kit. Here's a link: http://www.jegs.com/i/Edelbrock/350/2099/10002/-1

The kit should ramp up my engine to about 435hp, which seems pretty good for $1800. I was wondering if anyone had any input on these kits, or if anyone has used these with any success.
Otherwise, I'd just like to get some input as to what I could do to the engine to give it a bit more power with relatively moderate pricing.

Thanks for all the help

 

[Zerberfert]

We need more info about your bottom end to know how much that kit will improve your hp. I doubt you can go from a standard crate 350 and changed the heads and put in a cam and get 435hp(which is what the kit is doing basically). Now if your crate motor was bored or stroked or both, that will be a different story. Give us some more info and I'm sure the guru's will chime in.

 

[LOCKJAW]

Is this a hydraulic roller motor ? If you want to make 450 real HP from a 350 you will need to give up a lot of civility and "streetability". If this is for bracket racing or beating on hard you will need to start with a steel crank. Might be better to sell the motor you have and order up a ZZ383 or something comparable.just my. 02:dontknow:

 

[mrblanche]

You might check the Car Craft article that started several months ago on their build of a killer crate 350. They got like 330 hp out of it with just a few little changes before they ever installed it.

 

[mugzilla]

Lighter springs on the distributor and advance it as much as you can

 

[Mr.NastyTimes_86_eLky]

wait.! i see the issue here.. ------>crate 350 goodwrench small block<-------
I'm not at all impressed by that engine package.. 200hps @ 4000rpms..
its more of a work truck engine. tow engine. not street shredder machine...

with what you've spent on the engine and that Jegs combo.. you could have just bought THISSSSS http://www.summitracing.com/parts/MLL-BP3834CT1/ wooooot..

I'm getting more hp out of my 305ci motor than a 350ci..

 

[hotrodelco]

Looks like a pretty rowdy kit, make sure you got plenty of valve to piston clearance, or bad stuff happens! Be ready for more upgrades! :beer::texas:

 

[kraziac]

I'll try to keep up with all of you on here. My father bought the elco for me 5 years ago at 16. I've done everything to the car cosmetically, and now I want to move on to the engine. Its my everyday driver, but I want to turn her into a rubber burning street machine. The car came with the gm goodwrench 350 when I bought it. Here are the specs that I found for that engine,

Horsepower¹: 249 HP @ 5,000 RPM Torque¹: 304 FT/LBS @ 3,500 RPM
Redline: 5,200 RPM Comp. Ratio: 8.50:1
Heads: Cast Iron, 76 cc Valves: 1.940” I, 1.500” E
Camshaft Lift: Hydraulic; 0.390” I , 0.410” E Duration @ 0.050”: 195° I, 202° E
Block: 4 Bolt Main, 2 Piece Rear Main Seal, 4.000” Bore
Crankshaft: Cast Iron Nodular, 3.480” Stroke
Spark Plug: R44TS, Gap @ .035 For Points Distributor or .045 For HEI Distributor

I'm not looking for superchargers or turbos, but I'm definitely looking to put a bit more growl under the hood. All that I've come up with is the edelbrock 2099, that seems to be the easiest solution all in one performance package to get hp, But I'm up for suggestions. I call upon the gurus! I'd also like to keep the price range within reason of course. Thanks for all the help.

 

[kraziac]

heres a pic of my elco so you guys know what I'm working with

 

[hotrodelco]

Good look'n ride, a little smaller cam (280) duration will be more streetable. I'm not sure about the small block VTPC with much over 500 lift.:texas:

 

[fauxrs]

That kit doesnt come with the retrofit hyd roller lifters so you will need those, I also dont see any pushrods either, so dont forget them' you are now probably another 500 into that kit.

296/300 adv for a small block is pretty rowdy to be sure, plan on a much higher stall convertor in front of the trans, thats probably another $300 or so.

At over .500 lift I dont see you using the factory rocker arms with that cam, besides using old stamped rockers with an aggressive roller cam seems like a bad idea. Of course the kit doesnt include rockers either, better set aside another $250 or so

Sure looks like you are in for a lot more than $1900 to make that kit go.

In all I think thats a lot for the generic 350 crate, if I was expecting to make 400+ hp from a 350 I would want forged pistons and a better crank than the cast one that comes in that crate motor.

 

[1972elcaminomartin]

Im in the same boat as you my friend,im wanting to do something similar to my OLD SLUG,and was also looking at those top end kits,but by the sounds of it i may have to change direction..I will keep an eye on this thread,and it may help my decision.Thanks for starting it.:beer:

 

[fauxrs]

If you want to wake that motor up on a budget I would use a flat tappet cam like the Comp cams CL12-210 -2. I would then go with a set of AFR 180's and an air-gap intake. Headers and true duals with good timing and you should get to 1hp/cu.in. in a very streetable package that will work with the componants in your crate.

You will need rockers and pushrods plus head and intake bolts since you will be going away from the vortec heads.

 

[69/84]

I'm with the majorityon this one...That kit has a good price because it is incomplete...


Also, 1 HP per Cubic Inch as FAXURS said is a good rule of thumb on the street. Performance and Reliability are on different ends of the stick...Increase one and loose on the other...If it's your daily driver, build for your end result or you will be riding the bus to work more often than you likeoke: And 350 HP the stock bottom end will survive just fine if you redline at -5,000.

 

[JJLT1]

welcome Simon
as the whole package has to work together, i have to ask what gears and trans are you running??:texas:

 

[kraziac]

As far as the gear and the trans go, I'm not quite sure. All the info I could find on the engine I posted above. I'm not much of a motor head when it comes to specifics, but I can definitely grasp the basics. I always figured it would be easy to just buy performance parts, put them in the engine and just be off, but I'm learning that theres a bit more to it then that. I'm just wondering now ,if I do replace things in the engine, if I'm going into a can of worms by replacing everything throughout the car as well, including trans and gears, etc? More than anything I'm looking for a simple solution to add more power, but that might be more than what I bargained for.

 

[kraziac]

I'm not too savvy when it comes to engine specifics, but I can keep up when it comes to the basics. The car is my everyday driver so I'm not looking into turning it into a strip machine. But I'd definitely like it to have a bit more power. I'm not sure what gears or trans I'm running. Does it play a significant role as to what I'm trying to do?
I bought the car with the crate motor already in the elco, and I've done everything cosmetically, but now it time to move on to power. These are the specs I pulled off the internet on the motor (GM Goodwrench 350):
Valves (I/E) (in.): 1.940 / 1.500
Camshaft: Hyrdaulic Flat Tappet
Camshaft Lift (in.) I/E: 0.390 / 0.410
Cylinder Heads: Cast Iron
Fuel Requirements: 87 Octane
Horsepower: 249 @ 5000 RPM
Max RPM: 5500
Oil Pan: Rear Sump
Rocker Arms: 1.5 Ratio
Starter: Not Included
Torque: 304 @ 3500 rpm
Compression: 8.0 to 1 (76cc)
Valve Springs: 1.250 in. Diameter
Water Pump: Not Included
Core Value: 0
Block: Cast Iron, 4 bolt
Crankshaft: Cast Nodular, 3.480 in. Stroke
Cubic Inch: 350
Heads, Chamber Size: Cast Iron, 76cc
Intake Manifold: Not Included
Liters: 5.7
Piston Description: Cast Dish 4VR

As for the suggestions that fauxrs had, would I need to look into upgrades to the trans or other driving components of the car if I'm pumping up the motor? Like I said, I'm not too savvy on engine specifics, so I guess what I'm looking for is almost a list/guideline as to what exact parts I should look into putting in the car with corresponding power increase. And of course, on a budget and within reason. I appreciate all the help. I know I would not be upgrading my motor unless I had you're advice.

 

[JJLT1]

Automatic Transmission Identification and Information
http://www.maliburacing.com/auto_tranny_id.htm

 

[fauxrs]

As for the suggestions that fauxrs had, would I need to look into upgrades to the trans or other driving components of the car if I'm pumping up the motor? Like I said, I'm not too savvy on engine specifics, so I guess what I'm looking for is almost a list/guideline as to what exact parts I should look into putting in the car with corresponding power increase. And of course, on a budget and within reason. I appreciate all the help. I know I would not be upgrading my motor unless I had you're advice.

If you have a particularly steep rear gear (say 2.53:1 or thereabouts) it might be a bit doggish off the line because that Comp Cam doesnt really wake up until 1600-2000 rpm. This can be somewhat ameliorated by a slightly higher stall convertor, say 2100 rpm or so. This is just a bit looser than stock and can be easy to find from both B&M and TCI.

You could run your factory convertor of course to see if its acceptable, without knowing what your rear gear is I would hesitate to suggest you buy something you might not need. If your rear gear was a 3.08:1 I would think you could easily stick with the factory setup.

No modifications to the trans will be required though a shift kit is fun - the convertor just slides onto the nose of the input shaft, and rear gears would be completely up to you as there are several ways to skin that cat.

I'm not sure what gears or trans I'm running. Does it play a significant role as to what I'm trying to do?

As has already been mentioned, to get the most out of your choices everything must work together, if you are looking at significant changes to the output of the motor then yes gearing and transmission (usually convertor) has to be taken into account. for example:

Your motor now operates in a regime of off-idle to probably 5000 rpm right now, this means that the torque convertor has to be fairly tight (i.e low stall) to take advantage of that off-idle power. If however you were to increase the power range to 2500-6500 rpm then that convertor would be too tight as you would want it to slip enough to allow the engine to get to the 2500 rpm part of yourt powerband quicker. Thats a very abbreviated description of the issue of course.

 

[dstinch]

Fauxrs is right on this one, A strong motor with no gears = Poor performance. For your motor his pic of cam and afr heads is real good. You could also keep your same motor and put your money in a 700r4 with it'slow first gear and put in 342 rear gears will make a good daily driver and then build motor later. All this is not cheap! It's the whole package your looking for to be the best daily driver. Don