[roger1]

I'm going down to O'Reillys to get one of kits where I can bench bleed the master the standard way.

I'll do that and re-bleed the system and report back here how it comes out.

I'm thinking there is trapped air in the master.

I'm wondering if the "New Improved" method is really the "More Profit" method.

It's a Wagner rebuilt btw.

 

[roger1]

That's a yes on the rear brake adjusting. I've got them adjusted up to a slight drag. I even put new adjusters in. The teeth were worn a little on the old ones.

I just got back from O'Reillys with the bleeder kit and more fluid. It might be Thursday before I'm able to get it all done. Not sure I'll get a chance to work on the car tomorrow.

Btw, for interest sake here are the instructions that came with my Wagner m/c:

http://www.cardone.com/tech-help/br...brakes/how-it-works-and-best-practices/master-cylinder-bench-bleeding-procedure

It's from the Cardone site but it is word-for-word the same as the instructions packed with my Wagner.

 

[roger1]

I'll put it back on the bench. You are supposed to bench bleed them because the brake pedal doesn't push the plunger as far as using a dowel will.

And yes, my calipers are installed with the bleeders on top.

 

[roger1]

Back on this project today.

I went to the auto parts store and picked up a master cylinder bleed kit so I could put the master back on the bench and bleed it the old conventional way.

Got the master back on the bench and have been bleeding it for an hour with the conventional method.

I cannot get the rearward (front brake) part of the reservoir to quit spewing tiny bubbles from the inside. I'm warn out from pumping. No bubbles at all from the front reservoir compartment. That appears to be bled just fine.

This does not sound normal to me. It seems that everytime I've done this in the past, the tiny bubbles would completely disappear. Sometimes that would take a good deal of pumping. But, I've pumped this one to death and it keeps doing it.

Bad Master?

Again, this is a Wagner re-built I got from RockAuto.

Advice will definitely be appreciated. I'm about ready to eat this one go to NAPA and get a new and not re-built one.

 

[roger1]

Got to be. I'm sure glad I took it back off to re-bleed the old conventional way. Thanks for that advice.

Napa has a new and not re-built one. I think I'll go over and get it in the morning. I don't know who makes them for Napa but I do believe they are quality conscious on the parts they sell.
Autozone has a new Fenco but I think I feel better getting the one from Napa.

Looks like I'll just take the loss on the rebuilt Wagner from RockAuto. I don't think it's worth the shipping back to try and get a refund. It was $20.79 plus $4.00 shipping.

If I had left the original one on, I guess I wouldn't be dealing with this. It was working fine. I just thought it would be good to replace it since it was 30 years old and I was replacing everything else. It's been chunked but I wouldn't have put it back on anyway.

NEW NAPA MASTER

 

[roger1]

I got my new master from Napa and it bench bled just fine. The bubbles quit completely after pumping on it awhile using the conventional method with the clip on hoses.
This master also came with just plugs and instructions to bleed it the "New Improved" way. The guy at Napa says nobody uses that method. No one likes it.

I ran out of time today to re-bleed the rest of the system again.

I did make this out of one of my old covers though. Used JB Weld. I don't think that fitting is going anywhere.

With the plastic reservoir I don't want to put much pressure on it. Probably no more than 10 psi.
What do y'all think?

 

[roger1]

Hello Roger,,, I like the thought process on the cap to pressurize the MC! If ya use it two things pop in my mind, or whats left of it,, the rubber gasket, you need to modify it as well,, or my guess is you will blow brake fluid everywhere,, and the compressed air from your compressor is full of moisture and brake fluid is hyperscopic (absorbs moisture) so to me you are defeating the purpose,, but you are on the right track IMO,, still if you plan on doing your own maintenance the Motive bleeder is the cats meow!! I dont know what that means but sounds good,,,,, Matty man

Yeah, maybe 5 psi is enough. I think some people say time and gravity will work with no pressure at all.

Oh and I did modify the rubber gasket.

 

[roger1]

Ok, finally got a chance to get back to this deal.

Got the new master back on the car and got my wife to help bleed all the wheels using the conventional pump-the-pedal method. Test drove and still a little mushy feel. So back up on the stands to bleed again.

I thought this time I would try pressure using that old plastic cap with the air fitting glued into it. It didn't work very well. I used 10 psi but that would puff up the plastic cap some and it would leak air around the rubber seal. It also made it seep fluid around the rubber bushings where the plastic reservoir goes into the aluminum housing. I bled the rear brakes but stopped there. It was just seeping too much so I took it off and got my wife to pump the brakes again to finish the job. Oh well, the fitting in the cap thing was just a fun little experiment but it doesn't work. With pressure causing seepage around the reservoir bushings, I don't even see how you could pressure bleed a master like this using any kind of device.

Test drove again it it's feels right now. Firm pedal, stops positive and straight and will lock them up no problem. Got them a little hot and they faded some and I could start to smell them. So, I over tested on that run. I let it cool down and drove normally and they feel great.

One thing that's a little different is that there is a little noise from the master when pushing the brake down firmly. Kind of a buzz type of vibrating noise. I think I've heard brakes do that on other cars but not on this one before.

Anyway the moral of the story is to not use plugs to bench bleed a master. Maybe it works but one thing for sure is that if you have a bad master out of the box like I did, you will know it when bench bleeding the conventional way but you won't bleeding with the plugs.

Lesson learned and I'm really grateful to you guys that have helped and shared this process with me.